Affiliate Lounge Predatory

[bonustreak]

Maybe Marten is not there now, would not surprise me this company has a new aff manager every other month just about...

 

[adrenaline]

Mårten are there. I have been in contact with him today acctually.
And I have send him a mail where I asked him to check out the forum becase there are a few questions we are interested getting some answers to.

I also have to point out that Mårten is very helpful and a delight to work with. After Betsafe and Betsson came together I got in contact with him early in the process and he has been very helpful and responded quickly on all the questions I have had. Just have to point out that it is the situation aff.L keeps putting us in that are shitty and not anything personal against you Mårten=)

 

[MartenIsaksson]

Hello.

Apologies for late reply.
Affiliate Lounge is under new management, and completely new staff.
We also feel that the changes in terms and conditions were too harsh for our affiliates back in 2010. We can assure that we will stand behind our new terms and conditions, and these kind of changes will not be made. Please visit affiliatelounge.com/terms-of-use/ and you will find that all the old terms which was predatory against our affiliates has been removed.

Best Regards
Mårten Isaksson
Affiliate Manager - Affiliate Lounge

 

[bonustreak]

Affiliate Lounge is know for removing the entire team and replacing them repeatedly over the yrs, sorry but I need a bit more then what you just stated to gain my trust.

 

[adrenaline]

Sorry for the delay on this folks... Affiliate Lounge terms are still considered predatory by AGD. Reason is the following term, which is just a re-write of the one that got them in trouble in the first place:



Follow that with the termination clause and it is clear what they are trying to do here.

Originally Posted by Minimum Activity Clause

7.9 The Company reserves the right to set limits for a minimum level of activity on Affiliate's accounts. Such minimum activity levels will be continuously reviewed and the Company reserves the right to terminate any agreement not reaching the limit. Such limit shall not be unreasonably high and reflect the intention of avoiding accounts where the revenue does not cover the Company's internal costs for maintaining the account and the payout procedure.


Would apreciate a answer on this aswell Mårten. Hopes are that it will be removed.

 

[MartenIsaksson]

Hi,
Apologies for the delay but we have discussed internally how to answer all the concerns raised by AWD and its members.

1. Staff turnover in the past
It is true that affiliate lounge has had quite high staff turnover in the past. This has been primarily for individual personal reasons (desire to relocate, continue with studies etc) or, more recently, organisational changes following the acquisition of Betsafe in 2011. Whilst this may be cause for concern for some of our partners, Affiliate Lounge does not necessarily view this as a threat to existing or future partnership profitability. Many of the new staff in the current team are hired internally, bringing with them skills from other departments as well as facilitating the training required to handle Affiliate Lounge matters in a swift manner. High staff turnover is a reality for a fast moving industry like i-gaming and Affiliate Lounge has tackled this market reality by bolstering up the team to 13 persons with an additional 3 persons planned for employment in 2012. With this team in place we have the human resources required to handle and service our partners for the foreseeable future in a swift and professional manner, also catering for future staff replacements. We have also made, and continue to develop, new tools in the Affiliate Lounge system which will allow our affiliates greater independency in terms of report and optimising their promotion of our brands.

2. Minimum activity clause
Affiliate Lounge disagrees that the existing minimum activity clause is a simple rewording of the previous clause. Whilst the previous clause enforced a minimum NDC activity, the existing clause simply states that if the activity associated with a specific affiliate account is low enough so as to not justify its maintenance, then Affiliate Lounge has the option to close the account. Nevertheless, the existing clause offers greater flexibility for the affiliate and does not automatically penalise partners if NDC levels do not reach a minimum level.

Moreover, Affiliate Lounge has also removed the dormant account policy clause, following feedback from key partners, which did cause worry in the past.

We are convinced that today, Affiliate Lounge holds terms and conditions which are fair for both parties involved.

3. Future changes
Affiliate Lounge believes that today we have terms which will remain in place for the foreseeable future. Any changes to the existing terms may occur as a result of external factors such as the regulation of markets, introduction of new brands and gaming taxes or changes in company ownership. The existing terms and conditions are the result of a number of factors which occurred in 2011, namely
1. Listening to feedback from affiliates and partners.
2. The acquisition of betsafe by Betsson group.
3. The reregulation of the Danish gaming market.

Best regards
The Affiliate Lounge team

 

[Guard Dog]

Hi,
Apologies for the delay but we have discussed internally how to answer all the concerns raised by AWD and its members.

1. Staff turnover in the past
It is true that affiliate lounge has had quite high staff turnover in the past. This has been primarily for individual personal reasons (desire to relocate, continue with studies etc) or, more recently, organisational changes following the acquisition of Betsafe in 2011. Whilst this may be cause for concern for some of our partners, Affiliate Lounge does not necessarily view this as a threat to existing or future partnership profitability. Many of the new staff in the current team are hired internally, bringing with them skills from other departments as well as facilitating the training required to handle Affiliate Lounge matters in a swift manner. High staff turnover is a reality for a fast moving industry like i-gaming and Affiliate Lounge has tackled this market reality by bolstering up the team to 13 persons with an additional 3 persons planned for employment in 2012. With this team in place we have the human resources required to handle and service our partners for the foreseeable future in a swift and professional manner, also catering for future staff replacements. We have also made, and continue to develop, new tools in the Affiliate Lounge system which will allow our affiliates greater independency in terms of report and optimising their promotion of our brands.

Nobody was worried about your turnover except in relation to the Minimum Activity Clause.

2. Minimum activity clause
Affiliate Lounge disagrees that the existing minimum activity clause is a simple rewording of the previous clause. Whilst the previous clause enforced a minimum NDC activity, the existing clause simply states that if the activity associated with a specific affiliate account is low enough so as to not justify its maintenance, then Affiliate Lounge has the option to close the account. Nevertheless, the existing clause offers greater flexibility for the affiliate and does not automatically penalise partners if NDC levels do not reach a minimum level.

Moreover, Affiliate Lounge has also removed the dormant account policy clause, following feedback from key partners, which did cause worry in the past.

greater flexibility? ok. Yes, it is a rewording It was never an auto-termination before. The AM came in, weeded out the accounts to increase profitabiliy by stealing rightful commissions, and then looked good to their superiors. What's the difference now? The AM can now go in, say that account is not profitable, and terminate. Not much difference, really. And predatory both ways. Marten... how would you like it if you spent $10,000 promoting AL... then the company said... Sorry Marten - you didn't bring in enough affiliates, we aren't paying you this month or ever again. It's the same thing, really. We spend money to promote your casinos, you then decide not to pay us. It's unethical.

We are convinced that today, Affiliate Lounge holds terms and conditions which are fair for both parties involved.

3. Future changes
Affiliate Lounge believes that today we have terms which will remain in place for the foreseeable future. Any changes to the existing terms may occur as a result of external factors such as the regulation of markets, introduction of new brands and gaming taxes or changes in company ownership. The existing terms and conditions are the result of a number of factors which occurred in 2011, namely
1. Listening to feedback from affiliates and partners.
2. The acquisition of betsafe by Betsson group.
3. The reregulation of the Danish gaming market.

Again.... if AL believes these terms are good and ethical, then we know that AL is predatory. I think that is enough said, really.


Sorry, folks, unless AL removes this term.... we are keeping them in the predatory category where they belong.

 

[bonustreak]

Originally Posted by MartenIsaksson
We are convinced that today, Affiliate Lounge holds terms and conditions which are fair for both parties involved.

3. Future changes
Affiliate Lounge believes that today we have terms which will remain in place for the foreseeable future. Any changes to the existing terms may occur as a result of external factors such as the regulation of markets, introduction of new brands and gaming taxes or changes in company ownership. The existing terms and conditions are the result of a number of factors which occurred in 2011, namely
1. Listening to feedback from affiliates and partners.
2. The acquisition of betsafe by Betsson group.
3. The reregulation of the Danish gaming market.

I am glad you convinced yourselves but the changes made are very vague and you still leave open the chance to shut
down an affiliates account on a whim. We sign up for lifetime of players earnings no matter how much we promote your brand bottom line, plain and simple! You will not just decide to steal my earnings because say perhaps I was in an accident which lead to me not updating my sites for say 6 months. Still predatory folks...

 

[Engineer]

2. Minimum activity clause
Affiliate Lounge disagrees that the existing minimum activity clause is a simple rewording of the previous clause. Whilst the previous clause enforced a minimum NDC activity, the existing clause simply states that if the activity associated with a specific affiliate account is low enough so as to not justify its maintenance, then Affiliate Lounge has the option to close the account. Nevertheless, the existing clause offers greater flexibility for the affiliate and does not automatically penalise partners if NDC levels do not reach a minimum level.

What maintenance? It's just rows in a database; there is no real "maintenance" necessary. If an affiliate has earned more than the minimum payment threshold, you pay him/her; if not, you do nothing.

Marten... how would you like it if you spent $10,000 promoting AL... then the company said... Sorry Marten - you didn't bring in enough affiliates, we aren't paying you this month or ever again. It's the same thing, really. We spend money to promote your casinos, you then decide not to pay us. It's unethical.

True -- good point.

you still leave open the chance to shut down an affiliates account on a whim.

Yep...

The terms still aren't good enough. Any hint of a minimum activity rule that can be enforced willy-nilly isn't something I am comfortable with. Affiliates should steer clear of this group until additional changes are made.

 

[azureus]

What maintenance? It's just rows in a database; there is no real "maintenance" necessary. If an affiliate has earned more than the minimum payment threshold, you pay him/her; if not, you do nothing.

I find their "maintenance" very funny... They call it synchronization and it basically means that the stats are not updated regularly but at different times of the day, sometimes there's even a two-day or a three-day delay.

I almost got one of their AMs to confirm me on the phone that I've referred some users that are not tagged to my affiliate account. I knew the exact details about two players, first time my AM told me these players do not exist at all; then he told me they were referred by another affiliate; then he told me that he can tag them to my account.

This is highly suspicious. If the stats are correct and not manipulated, why aren't they displayed in real time? And why do the AMs claim that they do not have access to all the statistics (and they apparently have to contact another department)?

Yes, AL brands convert well but that's about it! The only thing I trust about their stats is the "hits log" (list of incoming clicks to their sites). The rest is very strange...

 

[PaaskeUK]

I find their "maintenance" very funny... They call it synchronization and it basically means that the stats are not updated regularly but at different times of the day, sometimes there's even a two-day or a three-day delay.

I almost got one of their AMs to confirm me on the phone that I've referred some users that are not tagged to my affiliate account. I knew the exact details about two players, first time my AM told me these players do not exist at all; then he told me they were referred by another affiliate; then he told me that he can tag them to my account.

This is highly suspicious. If the stats are correct and not manipulated, why aren't they displayed in real time? And why do the AMs claim that they do not have access to all the statistics (and they apparently have to contact another department)?

Yes, AL brands convert well but that's about it! The only thing I trust about their stats is the "hits log" (list of incoming clicks to their sites). The rest is very strange...

Still waiting for payment this month!! They keep giving me excuses technical problems etc.... soon had enough!!!

Also had a player sign up. It showed up yesterday on stats. 4 DAYS after player registered WTF.....

Is there no REP from Affiliate Lounge?? Would like explanation on why there is always problems with payments despite they say there is not.

Every time I ask them for what normal arranged payment date is every month. They don't give me any answer......

I really like their brands and had good conversions last year earned some god bucks.... But really soon had enough of their service

 

[Viriatu]

well once uppon a time i had a list of hundreds of players signing for the old propaganda poker, after migration to this system, i got exactly 0 comissions, talk about strange huh? clearly on my shit list...

 

[tobbe]

Affiliate Lounge is the worst! I was promoting Betsafe & NordicBet etc way before they moved to AL and it was all good.
Once migrated I found my account banned and no response from AM or their support. Neither did I receive any of the warning mails mentioned here.
Bye bye, 1500+ tagged players :/

 

[3joker]

tobbe, you should really try to get them to open your account again, especially if you have 1500 tagged players. One of my accounts was also in danger, but they merged all the different accounts I had and now I seem to be out of danger.

 

[Alison Brincat]

Hi tobbe,

We would like to see if there's anything we can do for you. Could you please PM me your affiliate username so we can have a look at it?

Best Regards

 

[3joker]

Nice to see Affiliate Lounge at the AGD forum!

 

[tobbe]

Hi tobbe,

We would like to see if there's anything we can do for you. Could you please PM me your affiliate username so we can have a look at it?

Best Regards

Wow, this was a bit surprising.
Looks like I don't have permission to PM/start conversations tho.
If you could PM me your email, or contact me at tobbe@freespins.eu that'd be great

 

[Alison Brincat]

Hi again,

I've sent you an email just now. Please get back to me when you got the chance, and we will look into the case.

Best Regards

 

[Viriatu]

I also lost my account and all migrated players so i would advice all to stay away despite any good will shown, the truth is when push comes to shove we know the guys in the top dont care they have grown on affiliates backs... they will close you and steal just like they did me... i now keep record of individual affiliate managers names so i know who NOT to work in the future...

 

[Ermin]

Its really disapointing couse they are one of the biggest as brands, they should be the best i think they would do so much better then couse all affiliates would actually want to have them on top of their websites since their brands are famous and strong. I never had any problems but i heard a lot from other affiliate friends that they got this emails about closing account and also know from expiriance they are not that "fun" to work with like other managers, they simply just dont giv a =(

I really really hope that they change their biz model couse even if they are on of the big guy i think they would be even bigger with out extra effort just by taking care of their affiliates.