Big trouble on Planet 23?

[lots0]

Bonne Chance N.V., an E-zone Company registered and licensed in the Netherlands Antilles, sublicenses Rival Powered games to the White Label operator(s) discussed in this thread. For its payment processing Bonne Chance N.V. has contracts with third party payment processors, these services are part of the White Label agreement for its marketing partners (the White Label). From time to time, its White Label partners may enter into an arrears situation due to high withdrawals. The White Label typically has a certain number of days to correct any such arrears.

It is important to note that the most typical reason for this arrears is bad promotion setup and misguided player classification. The White Label is 100% responsible for the marketing of their own property. This includes promotional design and configuration. When a White Label fails to pay its arrears it creates an awkward relationship between Operator (Bonne Chance N.V.) and the White Label partner whereas Bonne Chance N.V. is effectively bankrolling the property. ie paying the White Label's affiliates and customers.

In both this particular instance and instances in the past, Bonne Chance N.V. has taken a tough stance on its accounts receivable. Let it be clear that there currently is not, nor has there ever a doubling (or any false increase in) of hold or a 40% reserve taken on any deposits. These statements are simply incorrect.

Thank you for responding.

If I read between the lines.. It appears that Rival is blaming the licensees for their own downfall.

If it were just one or even two casinos that went down that would be plausible. But the fact is that Rival while labels are falling faster than old people walking on ice in leather soled shoes.

I really think these white labels giving up has more to do with this statement than anything... "...Bonne Chance N.V. has taken a tough stance on its accounts receivable.". But that is just my opinion.

The real question as far as affiliates are concerned;
As Bonne Chance is continuing to operate these casinos. Is Bonne Chance going to honor the affiliate agreements that their licensees agreed to?

 

[Aussie-Dave]

Let it be clear that there currently is not, nor has there ever a doubling (or any false increase in) of hold or a 40% reserve taken on any deposits. These statements are simply incorrect.

I don't promote a lot Rivals nor promote the 1's I have heavily. My finger is not always on the pulse in regard to Rival.

To get the facts...Who has said there is a 40% hold?

Was it Rival? Or was it a White Label casino?


Cheers

Dave

 

[GFPC]

Lets all call it as we see it.

RIVAL IS A TOOL - that's a fair assumption.

 

[CaseyM]

I still havent received any email from Planet23 so thanks for posting this

 

[KasinoKing]

To get the facts...Who has said there is a 40% hold?

belgamo and bonustreak reported it earlier in this thread.
See: https:// www. affiliateguarddog. com/forums/big-trouble-planet-23-a-t2849.html#post17268

But they didn't say where they got this information...

KK

 

[TheGamblingGuru]

I really don't understand why some of you guys are trippin about this. What's even worse is the fact that Bryan Bailey issues a "Warning"... and places all Rival "White Labels" in his "Rogue Pit" listed under "Not Recommended"

"At press time (30 June 2010), it seems that many of the white lables are either folding or being taken over by the software provider. Those few Rival Casinos that have separate support and payment processing remain valid - it's the white labels that are in trouble."

But yet at the same time Bailey does not even bother to issue a same type of warning for the late and no-pays that many players of "Lock Casino" have been experiencing lately. He did remove them from the acclaimed "accredited list" there but has still yet to issue any warning whatsoever.

Why is that? Protect the cash cow for a latter date to add back into the accredited list mix maybe...yea, exactly IMO. Casinomeister Warnings and the entire site has become a joke the last several months so my point here is that you guys should not put much faith in any new list he comes up with there because of his very bias opinions towards his own protected list of casinos. It's all bullshit!

That has nothing to do with my personal issues with Bailey, those are cold hard facts regarding the Lock Casino non-warning posted above! (needed to clarify that point) See for yourself....



I'm just sick and phucking tired of all of Bailey's and Max's double standards they tend to live by over there, it's not hard at all to see those either...all you have to do is really open your eyes!

Another recent example where Bailey and Max use their infamous double standards HERE

Now back to the fact that Rival Corporate may be taking back over some of the "white label casinos" .... is that really a bad thing? I personally do not think so, why would it be? Rival has never once not paid a player that was legitimately owed money have they? Of course not, why would they start now?

Rival has obviously had their head in the sand on several issues but withholding payment from a player is not one of them.
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[Bonne Chance N.V.]

All affiliates will be paid any/all outstanding amounts on time as usual regardless of the state of the White Label. BC NV will continue to uphold and honor affiliate agreements as they stand.

 

[Guard Dog]

Thank you for that response BC.

Also - can you contact user name: WCD Admin?

You can PM him here at AGD using the following link: https:// www. affiliateguarddog. com/forums/private.php?do=newpm&u=76


He has a tons of funds owed him by White Label Rivals and they need to be taken care of. It's a hefty sum. He can fill you in on the details, but I think you are the only person that can help at this point.

Sorry to derail.

 

[TheGamblingGuru]

Hey guys, just wanted to come back to my previous post above where I ragged on Bailey a bit there and give credit to Bailey for finally doing the right thing here and issuing a "Be Aware" type of 'Warning' to Lock Casino HERE today. Better late than never though IMO. I guess the message got thru to him about the 'Double Standard' post here, and IMO that was a good thing as he wrote about it today in his latest newsletter release.

I still don't agree with him about ALL of the Rival White Labels being lumped together and put into one big ole egg basket and listed there in his "Not-Recommended List" though! Most of us know that that is not a true fair assessment of the 'Rival White Label' situation. Some of us do know the marketing partners and owners behind these 'Rival White Label' brands and some of them ARE in-fact good peeps with the right intentions to do the right things in regard to their players.

If Rival Corporate truly stands behind their 'White Label Brands' as they have previously stated they do and will, then should ALL of them be listed as 'Not-Recommended"? Feedback Required here folks...

On another note Bailey stated in his newsletter that:

"These closures are not stemming from operator level issues; they are generated by the way Rival is set up."

If that were true then how does one explain the fact that the 400 Group has been around since the beginning with nary a scare of the same fate here? Not saying they won't go belly up, but in that same regard a 4 year record in this business for a new software start-up is not a bad record IMO!
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[GFPC]

Excuse my ignorance on this topic. So much going on daily its hard to keep up.

Is the general consensus to axe all Rival Casinos now? or

Keep a few on board?

If the later - which few to keep.

S

 

[Aussie-Dave]

Another recent example where Bailey and Max use their infamous double standards HERE

I don't want to turn this into a CM bash fest.
What Bryan chooses to do with his site is up to him.

However touting it as a "Casino Watchdog and Player Advocate since 1998"...IMHO, CM has way too many conflict of interests. These by proxy void his sites role as Player Advocates these days and has done for a many years now.

To run such a site need clear unbiased protocols.

Unfortunately too many posts and other incidents concerning Accredited gaming venues on CM get deleted or threads locked. It's got to the point if anyone says anything prerogative (even with cause) about any of these places they're met with strong disapproval.

IMHO ppl need to see it as it really is and not what it was.

This is the exact reason why I left CM. Of course no one read that post because that too was deleted and moved out of bounds, away from public eyes with in 30 min or so of posting it

Too many double standards; do as we say not as we do

Anyway...you make your own call, but to me, CM is nothing more than a glorified casino portal and message board running on media buys. Which strongly protects Accredited casinos but will sit by idle and let others get tarred and feathered for doing similar practices.



Cheers

Dave

 

[Pokerkeep]

Excuse my ignorance on this topic. So much going on daily its hard to keep up.

Is the general consensus to axe all Rival Casinos now? or

Keep a few on board?

If the later - which few to keep.

S

I'm working with Box24 (Affiliate wide) and SlotoCash. Both are solid in my opinion.

 

[tryme1]

As Pokerkeep said: the general consensus is probably this:

Box 24/Black Diamond Casino, SlotO'Cash and BetUS (AcesVegas?) are all OK because they use their own processors, customer support and are not white labels. Other than these, best advice seems to be to keep away from Rival at the moment.

On an unrelated note: can I just ask that the CasinoMeister/Bryan Bailey bashing stuff be kept away from this thread. This is AGD not CM and frankly, I come to this forum mainly because the level of conversation here is more signal than noise. Let's not change that.

 

[TheGamblingGuru]

On an unrelated note: can I just ask that the CasinoMeister/Bryan Bailey bashing stuff be kept away from this thread. This is AGD not CM and frankly, I come to this forum mainly because the level of conversation here is more signal than noise. Let's not change that.

Hey tryme, I think you and Dom both may have missed the points of my posts where I was stating facts for Andy's benefit, since Andy is now using Bailey's "accredited list" as a benchmark to check on rogue casinos before and after they are listed here then IMO, CM issues such as I have posted about here in this thread are in-fact relevant here in that regard. Aussie Dave also said he did not want to bash as well.

I don't believe anyone here would just simply want to bash CM's site just for the sole reason of bashing but some things are very relevant here especially when they concern which casinos over at CM get the boot to the Rogue Pit and which ones do not. If Andy had not previously decided to use Baileys list there as a benchmark then I agree there would most likely not be any reason to bring CM into the conversation here.

In a sense CM (Bailey) sits in on the virtual board room here.
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[Guard Dog]

I do agree with Tryme that we all want this board to be as civil as possible. Looking over all the boards in the industy, I believe we have the largest amount of quality posts here.

The CM portion of our program is very 'qualified'. We are not blatantly going to take rogue announcements and rogue/decertify programs. We also check why they were rogued and what purpose that serves.

And, I believe I've mentioned this before (BUT), There is a website in the works and the code is completed (now under testing). This website is called CasinoGuardDog.com and will be a small piece in our certification information soon. Nothing to see there now but a big logo - but soon enough.

Andy

 

[TheGamblingGuru]

The CM portion of our program is very 'qualified'. We are not blatantly going to take rogue announcements and rogue/decertify programs. We also check why they were rogued and what purpose that serves.

And that's exactly why the issues I posted about should be discussed, but yet not one of the very qualified peeps here other than myself and Aussie Dave have even bothered to answer my questions I asked in one of my previous posts HERE.

Hey, if you guys remember, I'm also sure I could dig them ALL up here as well, all of my previous posts in the past where I have complimented and hell, even given praise to Bailey and CM's site...many, many times. I don't think anyone in their right mind here would dispute that FACT.

So in that same regard the opposite can not or should not be stated here as well when these type of issues are raised?

I certainly hope that that is not the case and what you guys are implying here! I mean, can we at least try to keep it real here people?


REMEMBER: Bailey "Rogued" the entire Rival "White Label" stable of casinos! There's a shit load of those on this site. All of this is relevant. Please do not duck and jive about this, IMO this is a serious issue that needs to be discussed, this site and most of the regulars here have, and are still promoting most of these "White Labels", including myself.
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[universal4]

"At press time (30 June 2010), it seems that many of the white lables are either folding or being taken over by the software provider. Those few Rival Casinos that have separate support and payment processing remain valid - it's the white labels that are in trouble."

I have yet to catch up on the CM thread, but the above statement is a bit bothersome to me.

Does anyone have an actual list of the Rival White-labels that are failing or have failed?

The list of casinos that affiliates are now saying are in trouble, do not seem to match any list of casinos that I have gotten reports of actually closing or stating they are closing/having trouble.

The list of casino that will NOW have trouble moving forward, yes I see that as a problem, but inmyopinion, this is due MORE to affiliates pulling them due to the reports that have been circuklating more than was necessary BEFORE this list of properties that have been moved to the "not-recommended list"

I have been saying this for days and have posted about it in threads at other boards....but.....

Rick

 

[Guard Dog]

The only 'obvious' white label Rivals that have been taken over by Rival are:

Slot Power
Vanguard
Royal Apollo
Tradition
Planet23

Other Rival-owned are:

Pantasia
Mayan Fortune


For the rest of the white labels there is no way I know of to determine which are having a difficult time meeting the Rival Fees + Holdbacks. But, after recent events it is possible that the lesser known Rivals could have some problems.


Sister Casinos (Not White Labels):

Slotocash (Slotocash)
Box23 (AffiliateWide)
Black Diamond (AffiliateWide)
Vegas Aces (BetUS)

That's all I know as factual information. The rest, IMO, is speculation.

 

[universal4]

That is the exact point I have been trying to make for DAYS!!

And because of all this speculation, and all those who re-report the speculation as truth since they read it on the internet ("if it's posted somewhere on the internet it must be true") and then the subsequent folks who have now started roguing or adding these properties to their not-recommended lists, and the hundreds of affiliates that are now pulling down links to the said properties....

The white-labels are likely going to see MAJOR traffic drops and it will be more difficult for them going forward....


Rick

 

[TheGamblingGuru]

Does anyone have an actual list of the Rival White-labels that are failing or have failed?

This is Baileys "White Label" List from the ROGUE PIT

Also note that there are many on that list that have not failed:

21 Grand Casino
Always Vegas
Bet821 Casino
Club Vegas USA
Cocoa Casino
Connect2Casino
DaVinci's Gold
Dendera Casino Has been in CM's Rogue Pit for awhile now.
Fortune Reel
Irish Luck Casino
Lion Slots Casino
Mayan Fortune Casino
OrangeGamez
Pantasia Online Casino
Paradise 8 Casino
Planet23 Casino
Ruby Royal
Rockbet Online Casino Has been in CM's Rogue Pit for awhile now.
Royal Apollo
Simon Says Casino
Slot Power
Slots Jackpot Casino
Slots of Fortune
Superior Casino
SupremePlay Casino
This is Vegas
Tradition Casino Has been in CM's Rogue Pit for awhile now.
Tropica Casino
Vanguard Casino
Vegas Regal Casino
Vegas Sky Casino
VegasDays Casino


Connect2Casino should be in everyone's Rogue List, that outfit was Rogue for years when they were running on the RTG Platform. They don't even run the full suite of Rival games anyway.

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